Corvida: Hi, you seem new here. Welcome to the tech blogosphere, where Techmeme deals daily disappointment to all bloggers.
Automated news aggregation that's compelling to readers, fair to publishers, and works at all in the first place, is really hard to accomplish. Most of my life is just finding what Techmeme does wrong, and figuring out how to avoid that in the future. Techmeme is wrong all the time, and my work will never be complete.
I'd like to offer reassuring words, but looking at this particular event, I don't think Techmeme will be able to attribute things as you desire in any reasonable time frame. Existing software can't perform the kinds of reasoning you want with acceptable accuracy.
The (only) good news is that efforts you and other bloggers are taking to promote each other should help, since maybe that way bloggers will spot interesting things earlier.
Corvida Raven
· 1 year ago
We all deal disappointments, that's nothing new and it's life in general. What's more important to me are corrections. Quite frankly, things only disappoint me when I know they WON'T be corrected.
I appreciate you stopping by, but thank you for reassuring me that you are working hard to improve this.
sarahintampa
· 1 year ago
So how does Techmeme work? Links not firsties?
Frederic
· 1 year ago
The way I understand Techmeme, based on my own observations, is that it is based on a reputation system based on links, somewhat like PageRank.
It is also somewhat elitist in that respect, as a blog will only appear on it after it has received links from a few bloggers with high reputations and blogs with high reputations are more likely to become headlines. The mix of who links to whom and when is what decides where a story falls.
The elitism does keep the spam down - but sure it is frustrating when you break a story, but somebody ranked higher gets the headline. For what it's worth, I think it's still the best of the memetrackers out there.
sarahintampa
· 1 year ago
Makes sense...nothing's perfect....but SheGeeks made it on Techmeme today! :)
Frederic
· 1 year ago
Very true!
jongos
· 1 year ago
I'm not sure where or how Techmeme gets it's sources but I imagine they're running some kind of bot that surfs the net's reputable sources first, then the lesser known ones. There are a million an one reasons why they might not have found this post. I don't think it was necessarily an editorial decision or a slight.
Corvida Raven
· 1 year ago
I'm sure it wasn't intentional at all, but it's still flawed and it needs to better serve the community and give proper credit. They did the same for me when I covered Color Wars, the only reason I wasn't entirely pissed was because Mashable did their homework and gave me my credit, which is all I really cared for.
And in doing so, Techmeme needs a new algorithm that catches such things because whether I'm reputable or not, if the "reputable" is giving credit to someone else, THAT'S who's article should be headlining. Though in this case, the "reputable" didn't give credit and I'm sure it's because they didn't know.
Cyndy Aleo-Carreira
· 1 year ago
Thanks Corvida for the vitriol. ;)
@jongos What constitutes a "reputable" source? I know that Profy gets scanned by Techmeme, because we've been listed as discussion links. As a writer, I shrug it off, but as a person, it's difficult to consistently be relegated to the D-List when you broke the story two days before the source that gets the headline, and ergo, the eyeballs.
CyndyA
· 1 year ago
Gah. I need to complete a thought.
That should have said "As a writer, I shrug it off, knowing that's how Techmeme works, but as a person..."
Svetlana Gladkova
· 1 year ago
Profy is definitely scanned and I even remember two of our posts were quoted as actually sources. Though I think in this case it is because Cyndy was days ahead anyone else with her coverage but it does not make this case less disappointing.
Corvida, thank you for this post, it is really encouraging to see a blogger really passionate about such imperfections, even when it is not directly related to her own work.
Corvida Raven
· 1 year ago
My pleasure! Louis Gray touched on it when Mashable didn't give him credit and I just saw no reason why Techmeme should've been excused. I also put it out there to see if Gabe would try to manually add Profy to the related discussions even if he couldn't change who was headlining the articles surrounding Twubble, but I see he didn't do that either, or maybe it wasn't possible. Still...it sucks and I wouldn't wish something like that on anyone, since EVERYONE could use a little traffic these days
Svetlana Gladkova
· 1 year ago
I tend to believe Gabe really is unable to make manual changes - though of course I can't be sure of it :) Anyway, to tell you the truth, when Profy first made it to Techmeme discussion, I expected to see new visitors pouring in. And when it did not happen, I was really disappointed. Now I know the real traffic they can send and do not worry very much about it - for me being on Techmeme is more of being in the quoted circle, not really more than that :)
Corvida Raven
· 1 year ago
Why make a product that YOU can't even manually control? Reminds me of iRobot or something.
Svetlana Gladkova
· 1 year ago
It seems to be a major flaw with many services - they only work one way. Imagine Google coders manually changing search results for some query. Honestly, I can support human-powered search but not to this extent :)
Robert Seidman
· 1 year ago
websites that count on traffic from Techmeme to succeed will most likely fail. Sure, everyone could use a little traffic, but that's not how the world works. The most useful sites (as deemed by the wisdom of the crowds) over time, do find an audience.
Louis Gray will succeed where many of his own personal A-List bloggers will likely fail because he is actually providing very useful content and I don't recall ever seeing him whine about traffic, or finances in any public fashion. There is a lesson to be learned from that approach, at least if you want to be taken seriously by any sizable population.
Corvida, you're welcome to disagree, but I don't think Louis' experience with Mashable are a fair comparison to TechMeme at all. In one instance, someone used Louis' content without really sourcing him, and then did it again even after he'd addressed it! In the other, an automated service did not pick up what was apparently the very first blog to write about a topic. I'm a lot more forgiving of computer error than human error (especially human error that happened more than once!).
But if you have info that proves Gabe's automation is as somehow as nefarious as a cylon or a Terminator...I will probably change my mind. Whoever breaks that story probably won't have to worry about a link from TechMeme in order to pull in huge traffic. :-)
Corvida Raven
· 1 year ago
I've never known Louis to whine at all nor did I say he did. Louis made a point about giving credit where credit is due, and I'm simply doing the same. It's about credit and there's a lot to take in when you think of crediting someone on the web because credit goes very far in this community. It's not about traffic, but let's not push it to the side because it does factor in more than most would like to think.
I don't think Techmeme nefarious at all. It has it's value to some and none to others. However, it's more than obvious that it's biased and for all the credit that it gets, that's the last thing I would've thought about the site AND this community.
Louis Gray
· 1 year ago
Hey! My ears are burning. In the past, I have posted comments on robot services being imperfect, which is part of why I've been so interested in things like RSSMeme and ReadBurner, which are "democratic" versions with clear methodology. That said, I think TechMeme is a fantastic product with real relevance. I thought so when I didn't ever get on the site, and now, as I've made more-regular appearances. And I have met Gabe. He's a great guy and well-intentioned.
Corvida Raven
· 1 year ago
Care to tell me why your ears are burning?
Matt Shaulis
· 1 year ago
This is a theory:
Blame all the bloggers who linked to a story besides hers. That's how TechMeme works (partially, not to simplify your work Gabe... i just happen to firmly believe that's a piece of the puzzle.)... So it's really the blogosphere's fault for linking to a source other than hers in their own write-ups, perhaps.
Racing School
· 12 months ago
Techmeme is not exactly that bad. I feel it's rather cool with the item finder.
SEO
· 10 months ago
How many of us actually gives credit to people for something that is interesting, new, etc. Well, there are times where i also forget about giving credits to the pictures i used online.
All Comments
Automated news aggregation that's compelling to readers, fair to publishers, and works at all in the first place, is really hard to accomplish. Most of my life is just finding what Techmeme does wrong, and figuring out how to avoid that in the future. Techmeme is wrong all the time, and my work will never be complete.
I'd like to offer reassuring words, but looking at this particular event, I don't think Techmeme will be able to attribute things as you desire in any reasonable time frame. Existing software can't perform the kinds of reasoning you want with acceptable accuracy.
The (only) good news is that efforts you and other bloggers are taking to promote each other should help, since maybe that way bloggers will spot interesting things earlier.
I appreciate you stopping by, but thank you for reassuring me that you are working hard to improve this.
It is also somewhat elitist in that respect, as a blog will only appear on it after it has received links from a few bloggers with high reputations and blogs with high reputations are more likely to become headlines. The mix of who links to whom and when is what decides where a story falls.
The elitism does keep the spam down - but sure it is frustrating when you break a story, but somebody ranked higher gets the headline. For what it's worth, I think it's still the best of the memetrackers out there.
And in doing so, Techmeme needs a new algorithm that catches such things because whether I'm reputable or not, if the "reputable" is giving credit to someone else, THAT'S who's article should be headlining. Though in this case, the "reputable" didn't give credit and I'm sure it's because they didn't know.
@jongos What constitutes a "reputable" source? I know that Profy gets scanned by Techmeme, because we've been listed as discussion links. As a writer, I shrug it off, but as a person, it's difficult to consistently be relegated to the D-List when you broke the story two days before the source that gets the headline, and ergo, the eyeballs.
That should have said "As a writer, I shrug it off, knowing that's how Techmeme works, but as a person..."
Corvida, thank you for this post, it is really encouraging to see a blogger really passionate about such imperfections, even when it is not directly related to her own work.
and I just saw no reason why Techmeme should've been excused. I also put it
out there to see if Gabe would try to manually add Profy to the related
discussions even if he couldn't change who was headlining the articles
surrounding Twubble, but I see he didn't do that either, or maybe it wasn't
possible. Still...it sucks and I wouldn't wish something like that on
anyone, since EVERYONE could use a little traffic these days
Imagine Google coders manually changing search results for some query.
Honestly, I can support human-powered search but not to this extent :)
Louis Gray will succeed where many of his own personal A-List bloggers will likely fail because he is actually providing very useful content and I don't recall ever seeing him whine about traffic, or finances in any public fashion. There is a lesson to be learned from that approach, at least if you want to be taken seriously by any sizable population.
Corvida, you're welcome to disagree, but I don't think Louis' experience with Mashable are a fair comparison to TechMeme at all. In one instance, someone used Louis' content without really sourcing him, and then did it again even after he'd addressed it! In the other, an automated service did not pick up what was apparently the very first blog to write about a topic. I'm a lot more forgiving of computer error than human error (especially human error that happened more than once!).
But if you have info that proves Gabe's automation is as somehow as nefarious as a cylon or a Terminator...I will probably change my mind. Whoever breaks that story probably won't have to worry about a link from TechMeme in order to pull in huge traffic. :-)
I don't think Techmeme nefarious at all. It has it's value to some and none to others. However, it's more than obvious that it's biased and for all the credit that it gets, that's the last thing I would've thought about the site AND this community.
Blame all the bloggers who linked to a story besides hers. That's how TechMeme works (partially, not to simplify your work Gabe... i just happen to firmly believe that's a piece of the puzzle.)... So it's really the blogosphere's fault for linking to a source other than hers in their own write-ups, perhaps.